OBAMA OR MCCAIN WHO DO YOU CHOSE

[Chili327]

His name isn't even really Joe is it..?

I thought i heard that (sports radio. lol)

 

 

 

[brown_mustang]

Chili-Palmer ]

His name isn't even reallt Joe is it..?

I thought i heard that (sports radio. lol)

 

His middle name is Joseph, Joe for short. Lots of people go by his middle name. I cannot believe how the left and the media just smeared this guy and skirted the real question about Obama's socialist view.

[WARPIG]

It's amazing how two ppl can look at this in a totally different view. The left haven't done shit to "smear" anyone. The media did what Johnny Mac should have done before opening his big fat mouth in the debate about him. Johnny even apologized on Letterman for bringing him up. HOw do you righties not see that? It was JOhnny who bright him into the fray, NOT Obama. It's the McCain campaign trying to use him, (unsuccessfully) to point out untrue things about Obama tax plan.

 

"Cue the jeopardy theme music please"... here's some fun facts about Samuel Joseph Wurzelbacher; He's not a licensed plumber, he makes 40k a year, the business he wants to buy only makes 100k a year, he owes almost 1200$ in back taxes and is a registered republican who voted in the primaries!!! How is that smearing him? Those are facts. I ask anyone here in this thread, do you know ANY plumber that makes over 250K a year? That is a valid question being that Johnny Mac is trying to exploit plumbers for their vote by using Obama's tax plan.

 

 

 

[brown_mustang]

It's amazing how two ppl can look at this in a totally different view. The left haven't done shit to "smear" anyone. The media did what Johnny Mac should have done before opening his big fat mouth in the debate about him. Johnny even apologized on Letterman for bringing him up. HOw do you righties not see that? It was JOhnny who bright him into the fray, NOT Obama. It's the McCain campaign trying to use him, (unsuccessfully) to point out untrue things about Obama tax plan.

 

"Cue the jeopardy theme music please"... here's some fun facts about Samuel Joseph Wurzelbacher; He's not a licensed plumber, he makes 40k a year, the business he wants to buy only makes 100k a year, he owes almost 1200$ in back taxes and is a registered republican who voted in the primaries!!! How is that smearing him? Those are facts. I ask anyone here in this thread, do you know ANY plumber that makes over 250K a year? That is a valid question being that Johnny Mac is trying to exploit plumbers for their vote by using Obama's tax plan.

 

 

 

 

 

No matter who asked the question, Obama stated that he wants to spread the wealth around. It is a legitimate question no matter who asked it.

[HogWild_101st]

Brown_Mustang ]

No matter who asked the question, Obama stated that he wants to spread the wealth around. It is a legitimate question no matter who asked it.

 

 

DING DING DING !!!!!!!! WE HAVE A WINNNER

 

 

Just understand Mustang, that even though you may prefer to stand on your own two feet and take care of yourself, there are some people who want the government to take care of them, to support them, to be the father to them they may have never had. There is now a whole generation of people who feel they are entitled to the the money other people earn, and it's pretty sickening too. And there are politicians who are willing to forcebly take that money from the well off and give it to the not so well off in a effort to build a voting block they can rely on.

 

If I as a private citizen did such a thing, I would be called a criminal.

[WARPIG]

You guys are killing me! Hahahaaaaa!!!! Do you guys know that Obama is ONLY talking about taking away Bush's rididulous tax cut? He's not about taxing anymore then what was set by Clinton in the 90's. How do you not see that? LOL That tax cut should have never happen. It's part of the reason we are in the shape we are today. You like how our ecomony is? This is good for you? give me a break guys. You want to demonize everything Obama purposes. It's just silly. He only wants to go back to what it was before. You are taking out of context his statement. The wealth is this country does need to be spread out. Under Bush and his stupid tax cuts the wealthy have gotten more and more wealthy and the middle class are being pushed into poor and lower class category. That's a fact. We have not seen this kind of divide in decades. YES, SPREAD THE WEALTH! That's not an entitlement at all Hog. You, of course will skew it to your liking to push your candidate's agenda.

[HippieChik]

Some facts to chew on:

 

DEBATE REALITY CHECK: BUSH AND MCCAIN BUDGETS

October 02, 2008

 

Tonight, Joe Biden said: “[McCain] voted 4 out of 5 times on George Bush's budget.†[Vice Presidential Debate, 10/2/08]

 

 

 

FACT: MCCAIN SUPPORTED 4 OF 5 BUSH BUDGETS

 

 

· McCain Voted for 4 of 5 Bush Budgets Adding Up To $9.8 Trillion In Spending. McCain supported four of the five Bush budgets that the Senate voted on from 2001-2006. McCain voted for the FY 2002 budget, the FY 2005 budget, the FY 2006 budget and the FY 2007 budget. The budgets added up to $9.8 Trillion in spending. [2001 Senate Vote #98; 2004 Senate Vote #58; 2005 Senate Vote #114; 2006 Senate Vote #74]

 

 

 

FACT: MCCAIN’S SPENDING PROPOSALS DON’T ADD UP AND ARE FAR MORE COSTLY THEN OBAMA’S PLANS

 

 

· McCain Offers Four More Years Of Soaring Deficits. Just like George Bush, McCain budget plan offers four more years of soaring deficits. The non-partisan Tax Policy Center said McCain’s tax plan would add $3.4 trillion to the debt over the next decade, and cuts for the wealthy instead of middle class families. [Tax Policy Center, 7/23/08, p. 42]

 

 

· New York Times: McCain’s Budget Will Add $200 Or $300 Billion To The Deficit Per Year. “The Obama campaign claims it can pay for all this, and even reduce the deficit, through tax increases and spending cuts. I think a more skeptical look at its budget leaves you worried it may add something like $50 billion a year to the deficit. But applying the same arched brow to Mr. McCain’s stated plans leaves you worried that he will add $200 billion or $300 billion or, depending on his voluntary tax system, even more.†[New York Times, 6/18/08 ]

 

 

· McCain Has No Plan To Pay For His Tax Cuts For The Wealthy And Corporations. McCain’s promise to continue George Bush’s tax breaks for the wealthiest Americans and give big corporate interests a tax cut would cost $340 billion a year, according to the Tax Policy Center. The Wall Street Journal, Washington Post, and New York Times have all raised questions about whether McCain can pay for these tax breaks. In fact, a Washington Post editorial even said that his budget plan is “not credible†[Editorial, Washington Post, 7/14/08 ; Editorial, New York Times, 7/12/08 ; Wall Street Journal, 4/16/08]

 

 

· Washington Post: McCain’s Approach To Taxes Is Far More Costly Than Obama’s. “There is a serious debate to be had in this presidential campaign about the fundamentally different tax policies of Barack Obama and John McCain. Then there is the phony, misleading and at times outright dishonest debate that the McCain campaign has been waging -- most recently with a television ad. The two candidates have very different positions on taxes. Mr. Obama wants to raise taxes on the wealthiest Americans and cut them substantially for low- and middle-income taxpayers. He would cut taxes for more households, and by a larger amount, than Mr. McCain, who would give the greatest benefits to wealthy households and corporations. … The McCain campaign insists on completely misrepresenting Mr. Obama's plan. … The country can't afford the tax cuts either man is promising, although Mr. McCain's approach is by far the more costly. We don't expect either side to admit that. But neither side should get to outright lie about its opponent's positions, either.†[Editorial, Washington Post, 8/31/08 ]

 

 

· Washington Post: McCain’s Plan To Balance The Budget By 2013 “Is Not Credible.†“McCain says that President McCain would balance the federal budget by 2013. The plan is not credible. … Mr. McCain sells American voters short -- and he does himself a disservice -- with his implausible claim.†[Editorial, Washington Post, 7/14/08 ]

 

 

· New York Times: McCain Cannot Balance The Budget On A Crusade Against Pork And A One-Year Sliver Of Federal Spending And He Either Has A “Secret Plan To Balance The Budget Or He’s Blowing Smoke.†“Mr. McCain’s main campaign promises, if fulfilled, would lead to huge budget deficits. Extending the Bush tax cuts, enacting more tax cuts of his own and staying the course in Iraq would cost hundreds of billions of dollars more, every year, than the small bore spending cuts he has specified. Mr. McCain cannot balance the budget on a crusade against pork and a one-year freeze in a sliver of federal spending. Either he has a secret plan to balance the budget or he’s blowing smoke.†[Editorial, New York Times, 7/12/08 ]

 

 

 

DEBATE REALITY CHECK: WORKERS

October 02, 2008

 

 

Tonight, Sarah Palin said: “American workforce is the greatest in this world, with the ingenuity and the work ethic that is just entrenched in our workforce.†[Vice Presidential Debate, 10/2/08]

 

The Facts: John McCain Has Repeatedly Voted Against The Interests of American Workers.

 

 

FACT: MCCAIN HAS REPEATEDLY OPPOSED EFFORTS TO HELP WORKERS INCLUDING VOTING AT LEAST 19 TIMES AGAINST INCREASING THE MINIMUM WAGE

 

 

McCain Has Voted At Least 19 Times Against Increasing The Minimum Wage. Since arriving in the U.S. Senate in 1987, McCain has voted against increasing the minimum wage at least 19 times. [2007 Senate Vote #23, 126; 2006 Senate Vote #179; 2005 Senate Votes #26, 257; 2000 Senate Vote #76; 1999 Senate Votes #94, 239; 1998 Senate Vote #278; 1996 Senate Votes #58, 184, 186; 1995 Senate Votes #344, 519; 1989 Senate Votes #29, 39, 68, 1988 Senate Votes #335, 336]

 

McCain Has Repeatedly Voted Against Measures To Help Displaced Workers. In 2004, McCain voted against an amendment to ensure that existing Trade Adjustment Assistance (TAA) benefits be made available to service and high-tech workers. In 2002, McCain voted against a proposal, sponsored by Senator John Edwards, which included funding for an emergency assistance grant program for community colleges that provide training programs for displaced workers. In 1995, McCain voted against a Moynihan amendment to maintain the worker retraining assistance part of the Trade Adjustment Assistance program, which provides job retraining for workers laid off as a direct result of an international trade program such as NAFTA. The amendment was to a bill that would repeal these training services but would retain the income assistance part of the program. According to the Washington Post, “Organized labor won a major victory Tuesday when a program of special assistance for workers who lose their jobs as a result of trade agreements was removed from the block grant. The vote left the program intact as a federally guaranteed entitlement.†[2004 Senate Vote #80, 5/4/2004; 2002 Senate Vote #111, 5/15/02; Congressional Quarterly Daily Monitor, 5/15/02; 1995 Senate Vote #482, 10/10/95]

 

 

McCain Repeatedly Voted Against Repealing Tax Breaks That Encourage American Corporations To Ship Jobs Overseas. In 1995, 2004, and 2005, John McCain voted against repealing the deferral clause in the U.S. tax code that has provided an incentive for American companies to locate production facilities outside of the United States. Under the current tax code, U.S. companies are required to pay a 35 percent tax on any income earned inside the United States. However, under the deferral clause, U.S. corporations can defer paying taxes on any active income earned by a foreign subsidiary until it is repatriated to the United States. And as USA Today has noted, these transfers “often don't happen for years. General Electric, for example, has $62 billion in ‘undistributed earnings’ parked offshore, according to recent Securities and Exchange Commission filings. Drug giant Pfizer boasts $60 billion. ExxonMobil has $56 billion.†[uSA Today, 3/20/08 ; Senate Vote #63, 3/17/05; Senate Vote #83, 5/5/04; Senate Vote #517, 10/26/95]

 

 

McCain Repeatedly Opposed The Ergonomics Rule, Aimed At Curbing Certain Workplace Injuries And Health Problems. In 2000 and 2001, McCain repeatedly voted to repeal or block implementation of ergonomics regulations, requiring “about 1.6 million employers to set up programs to prevent repetitive motion injuries.†[2001 Senate Vote #15, 3/6/2001; 2000 Senate Vote #143, 6/22/2000; 2000 Senate Vote #171, 6/30/2000; Congressional Quarterly, 6/30/2000]

 

McCain Has Repeatedly Voted To Strike Davis-Bacon Protections. McCain has repeatedly and consistently voted to provide exemptions from or limitations to the Davis-Bacon Act, requiring that workers be paid the prevailing local wage on federal construction sites. [1999 Senate Vote #320; 1996 Senate Votes #134; 1994 Senate Votes #248, 119, 116, 1993 Senate Votes #67, 289; 1992 Senate Votes #205, 105; 1990 Senate Votes #122, 120; 1989 Senate Votes #181, 36; 1987 Senate Vote #284]

 

McCain Voted Against Requiring 60 Day Notice For Plant Closings And Layoffs. McCain voted to kill a provision that requires employers of at least 100 full-time workers to give 60 days’ notice of plant closings and mass layoffs. [s 1420, Vote #180, 7/9/87, Failed 40-60: R 36-10 D 4-50]

 

McCain Has Repeatedly Voted Against Measures To Help Displaced Workers. In 2004, McCain voted against an amendment that provides that existing Trade Adjustment Assistance (TAA) benefits be made available to service and high-tech workers. In 2002, McCain voted against a proposal, sponsored by Senator John Edwards, which included funding for an emergency assistance grant program for community colleges that provide training programs for displaced workers. In 1995, McCain voted against a Moynihan amendment to maintain the worker retraining assistance part of the Trade Adjustment Assistance program, which provides job retraining for workers laid off as a direct result of an international trade program such as NAFTA. [2004 Senate Vote #80, 5/4/2004; HR 3009, Vote 111, 5/15/02; Congressional Quarterly Daily Monitor, 5/15/02; S 143, Vote 482, 10/10/95]

 

DEBATE REALITY CHECK: EDUCATION

Tonight, Sarah Palin said: “We need to put more of an emphasis on the profession of teaching, we need to make sure that education in either one of our agendas, I think, absolute top of the line.†[Vice Presidential Debate, 10/2/08]

 

The facts: Education has not been a top priority for McCain. He has repeatedly opposed education funding, including funds to hire 100,000 new teachers.

 

 

 

FACT: MCCAIN HAS REPEATEDLY VOTED AGAINST INCREASED FUNDING FOR NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND, MORE TEACHERS AND FOR FAILING SCHOOLS AND DISADVANTAGED STUDENTS

 

 

· McCain Voted Against Reducing the Bush Tax Cuts For The Wealthy In Order to Fully Fund The No Child Left Behind Act. McCain voted against a proposal to reduce President Bush’s tax cuts for the wealthy and instead use those funds for deficit reduction and to fully fund the No Child Left Behind Act. [sCR 23, Vote 60, 3/19/03; Vote 64, 3/16/06; Vote 58, 3/16/06; Vote 56, 3/16/05; Vote 35, 3/10/04; Vote 330, 9/9/03; Vote 5, 1/16/03]

 

 

· McCain Repeatedly Opposed Funding To Help Reduce Class Sizes By Hiring 100,000 New Teachers. On four different occasions, McCain voted against funding to hire 100,000 new teachers to help reduce class sizes. In addition, he has repeatedly voted against increased funding for teacher training programs. [2001 Senate Vote #103, 5/15/2001; 1999 Senate Vote #41, 3/11/1999; 1998 Senate Vote #93, 4/22/1998; 1998 Senate Vote #50, 3/31/1998]

 

 

· McCain Opposed Increased Education Funds For Failing Schools And Disadvantaged Students. McCain has repeatedly voted against increased funds for education programs designed to assist disadvantaged students. For instance, he opposed providing $250 million to help ensure accountability in programs for disadvantaged students and to assist states in their efforts to turn around failing schools. McCain even opposed funding for states to reduce dropout rates at middle and high schools with significant dropout problems. [Vote 330, 9/9/03; Vote 90, 5/3/00; Vote 147, 6/27/00]

 

 

· McCain Education Adviser Said “Education Is Obviously Not The Issue Senator McCain Spends The Most Time On.†“In comparison to Senator Barack Obama’s education plan, Senator John McCain’s is downright terse. Among his short list of initiatives, Mr. McCain, the Republican presidential nominee, includes bonus pay for teachers who raise student achievement or who take jobs in hard-to-staff schools, an expansion of after-school tutoring, and new federal support for online schools and for the voucher program in Washington, D.C. The brevity of Mr. McCain’s plan reflects his view that the federal government should play a limited role in public education, and his commitment to holding the line on education spending, said Lisa Graham Keegan, a McCain adviser and former Arizona education commissioner. ‘Education is obviously not the issue Senator McCain spends the most time on,’ Ms. Keegan said, adding that his plan’s limited scope should not be interpreted as a lack of commitment to education and school reform. ‘He’s been a quiet and consistent supporter of parents and educators who he thinks are making a difference.’ … Mr. McCain would reallocate 60 percent of the $3 billion in current federal spending on teacher quality programs to finance direct payments to ‘high-performing teachers’ who take jobs in high-needs schools and to those who improve achievement.†[New York Times, 9/10/08 ]

 

 

 

FACT: MCCAIN WON’T FULLY FUND NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND LIKE HE CLAIMS

 

 

· Washington Post Editorial: McCain’s Promise To Slow Discretionary Spending In A Bid To Balance The Budget Leaves Little Money For Initiatives Or To Fully Fund No Child Left Behind. McCain’s “education plan is both late in coming and still a work in progress, and his promise to slow discretionary spending in a bid to balance the budget leaves little money for initiatives or to fully fund No Child Left Behind.†[Editorial, Washington Post, 8/20/08 ]

 

 

· McCain Education Adviser Said McCain Believes NCLB Is Adequately Funded. “McCain has talked about freezing education funding until a review can be done of which projects work and which don’t. Money may get re-allocated among different programs but [education adviser Lisa Graham] Keegan said McCain believes NCLB is adequately funded.†[AJC, 6/16/08 ]

 

· McCain’s Plan To Freeze Discretionary Federal Spending Applies To Education Programs, Including Title I Under NCLB. “I'll go into more detail in a bit, but I wanted to highlight two important things I thought Keegan said. First, McCain's plan to freeze discretionary federal spending applies to education programs, including the largest program under the NCLB law, Title I. Though as president he may seek to re-allocate money between programs, McCain believes the NCLB law is ‘adequately funded,’ Keegan said. So states and schools shouldn't look for any additional federal dollars in a McCain budget.†[Education Week, 6/12/08 ]

 

 

FACT: MCCAIN SUPPORTS VOUCHERS

 

· McCain Supports Taking Money Away From The Public School System To Fund Private School Vouchers. McCain supports private school vouchers that take fund from public schools. In 2001, he also voted for President Bush’s voucher proposal. [s 1, Vote #179 , 6/12/01]

 

 

· McCain Supports Vouchers. In an interview, McCain said, “I support vouchers.†[spartanburg Herald-Journal, 7/26/07; NEA McCain Education Tracking Document]

 

 

 

DEBATE REALITY CHECK: TROOP FUNDING

Today, Sarah Palin said Obama opposed funding for the troops. [Vice Presidential Debate, 10/2/08]

 

FACT: ATTACK ON TROOP FUNDING IS “HIGHLY MISLEADINGâ€

 

AP: Charge That Obama Voted Against Troop Funding Is “Misleading.†“The ad's most inflammatory charge — that Obama voted against troop funding in Iraq and Afghanistan — is misleading. The Illinois senator consistently voted to fund the troops once elected to the Senate.†[AP, 7/18/08 ]

Fact Check.org: The Claim That Obama Voted To Cut Off Funding For Our Troops Is “Highly Misleading.†Factcheck.org wrote, “Lieberman also said that "colleagues like Barack Obama were voting to cut off funding for our American troops on the battlefield." That's a highly misleading claim that McCain also touted in an ad this summer. Obama has voted in favor of war-funding bills at least 10 times since becoming a senator. The McCain camp and Republicans cite one vote Obama cast against a funding bill as justification for their claim – but that vote came after President Bush had vetoed a version of the bill that included a date for withdrawal from Iraq. In fact, most Republicans voted against that 2007 war-funding bill Obama and the Democrats supported.†[Factcheck.org, 9/3/08 ]

FACT: USING THE SAME STANDARD, MCCAIN HAS SUPPORTED CUTTING OF FUNDING TO THE TROOPS

 

FactCheck.org: Using The McCain Campaign’s Standards, It Would Be “Literally True†To Say That “McCain Urged A Veto Of Funding For Our Troops.†“The McCain camp and Republicans cite one vote Obama cast against a funding bill as justification for their claim – but that vote came after President Bush had vetoed a version of the bill that included a date for withdrawal from Iraq. In fact, most Republicans voted against that 2007 war-funding bill Obama and the Democrats supported. McCain was absent for the vote, but he urged the president to veto the bill. As we said about this subject previously, ‘Based on those facts, it would be literally true to say that ‘McCain urged a veto of funding for our troops.’ But that would be oversimplified to the point of being seriously misleading.’ And the same goes for Lieberman’s claim at the convention.†[FactCheck.org, 9/3/08 ]

 

McCain Cheered On Bush And Welcomed His Veto Of The Iraq And Afghanistan Spending Bill, Noting That The Congress Needed To Pass A New Spending Bill Because The “Troops In The Field Are Waiting On Our Action.†McCain: “I look forward to the President’s prompt veto of this misguided bill. After the President rejects the legislation, I sincerely hope that the Congress will finally get serious about passing a measure that can be enacted into law. … We need to send a bill to the President that he can sign, and we need to do it as soon as possible – our troops in the field are waiting on our action.†[McCain release, 4/26/07 ]

 

McCain Introduced Amendment To Cut Off Funds For Troops In Somalia. On October 14, 1993, McCain introduced an amendment to the Fiscal Year 1994 Department of Defense appropriations bill to prohibit funding of U.S. military operations in Somalia except for the withdrawal of all U.S. troops. The amendment was defeated by a tabling motion, introduced by Senator Thurman, 61-38 (Republicans: 16-28; Democrats: 45-10). [2003 Senate Vote 313, 10/14/93, Motion agreed to 61-38: R 16-28; D 45-10; Biden: Y to table]

 

Ø McCain Later Admitted That He “Regretted†Introducing The Amendment And Stated “In Hindsight, I Wish I Had Not Undertaken So Drastic A Step.†“On October 14, 1993, eleven days after the ambush of our rangers in Mogadishu, I offered an amendment on the Senate floor restricting funds for American forces in Somalia to the purpose of their ‘prompt and orderly withdrawal.’ President Clinton criticized the amendment and its supporters for our ‘headlong rush into isolationism,’ which it was not. But it was an encroachment on presidential authority and a retreat in the face of aggression from an inferior foe that I would never have contemplated in the past. And even though I regretted my action, I felt the circumstances were so compelling that it was a necessary response to a failed policy that had cost the lives of eighteen good Americans . In hindsight, I wish I had not undertaken so drastic a step. But, as the administration had already agreed to compromise legislation that would have set a date for withdrawing our forces five months hence, my demand for a more prompt retreat was only a difference of timing not in kind. I could hardly see how our troops' security or America's international reputation would be better served by a slow retreat than a quick one.†[John McCain, “Worth the Fighting For,†p.280]

 

DEBATE REALITY CHECK: MCCAIN VOTED AGAINST RENEWABLE ENERGY

Tonight, Joe Biden said: “[McCain] voted 20 times against funding alternative energy.†[Vice Presidential Debate, 10/2/08]

 

 

FACT: MCCAIN HAS VOTED AGAINST RENEWABLE ENERGY MORE THAN 20 TIMES

 

 

1992: McCain Voted Against Proceeding On A Vote On The 1992 Energy Bill. McCain voted against proceeding to the bill to encourage energy conservation and increase domestic energy production. [1992 Senate Vote 150, 7/23/1992]

 

1999: McCain Voted Against Funding for Renewable Energy Programs. McCain opposed an amendment that would increase funding for energy supply and research and development activities for renewable energy sources by reducing unnecessary Energy Department contractor travel expenses. McCain voted to kill an appeal made by the chair that this amendment was out of order, effectively voting to kill the amendment. [1999 Senate Vote 171, 6/16/1999]

 

2001: McCain Voted Against Establishing Renewable Energy Tax Credits. McCain voted against establishing tax credits for investments in renewable energy technologies, incentives for new energy efficient residential construction and tax deductions for increased energy efficiency in commercial buildings. [2001 Senate Vote 125, 5/21/2001]

 

2002: McCain Voted Against Renewable Energy Mandate. McCain voted against an amendment to require utilities to generate 10 percent of electricity from renewable energy facilities by 2020. [2002 Senate Vote 55, 3/21/2002]

 

2002: McCain Voted To Allow Exemptions From Renewable Energy Standards. McCain voted for an amendment that would exempt retail electric suppliers in states that have state renewable energy standards from the federal renewable standard in the underlying amendment. [2002 Senate Vote 58, 3/21/2002]

 

2002: McCain Voted To Allow Exemptions From Renewable Energy Standards. McCain voted to allow the Governor of a State the ability to waive certain provisions of the Federal mandate, if the provisions would adversely affect retail electric customers of the State, with respect to the application of the Federal renewable portfolio standard. [2002 Senate Vote 59, 3/21/2002]

 

2002: McCain Voted Against Proceeding On A Measure To Provide $14.1 Billion In Energy-Related Tax Incentives. McCain voted against a motion to invoke cloture on measure that would overhaul the nation's energy policies, restructure the electricity system and provide for $14.1 billion in energy-related tax incentives. [2002 Senate Vote 77, 4/23/2002]

 

2002: McCain Voted Against Phasing Out MBTE And Voted Against An Ethanol Mandate. McCain voted against keeping a renewable fuel program, including the phase-out of MTBE in the energy bill. [2002 Senate Vote 78, 4/23/2002]

 

2002: McCain Voted Against Alternative Fuels Tax Credits. McCain voted to strike provisions in the 2002 energy bill relating to alternative vehicles and fuel incentives. [2002 Senate Vote 91, 4/25/2002]

 

2002: McCain Voted Against The 2002 Energy Bill. McCain voted against the passage of a bill that would overhaul the nation's energy policies, restructure the electricity system and provide for approximately $15 billion in energy-related tax incentives. [2002 Senate Vote 94, 4/25/2002]

 

2003: McCain Voted For Waivers Of Ethanol Mandates For States That Can Meet Clean Air Standards Without Adding Renewable Fuels. McCain voted to allow states to waive the ethanol mandate in the renewable fuel program if the EPA Administrator determines, after a public notice and comment period, that implementation of renewable fuel requirement is not necessary to meet Clean Air standards, because States or regions can meet standards without adding renewable fuels. [2003 Senate Vote 203, 6/3/2003]

 

2003: McCain Voted to Allow Governors to Waive Ethanol Mandates. McCain voted to add language to the 2003 energy bill that would make a state subject to ethanol requirements only if the state's governor elected to participate. [2003 Senate Vote 204, 6/3/2003]

 

2003: McCain Voted to Allow the President Exempt States Or Regions From Renewable Energy Mandates McCain voted for an amendment that adds language that would give the president authority to exempt a state or geographic region from the ethanol requirements of the underlying amendment for 30 days if the Energy secretary determines the requirements have caused or will cause the average cost of gasoline to increase by at least 10 cents per gallon. The Frist amendment would require gasoline refineries to use 5 billion gallons of ethanol or other alternative renewable fuels annually by 2012, phase out the use of methyl tertiary butyl ether (MTBE) and eliminate a requirement that gasoline sold in regions with high levels of air pollution contain 2 percent oxygen by volume. [2003 Senate Vote 206, 6/4/2003]

 

2003: McCain Voted To Limit The Ethanol Mandate To The Midwest. McCain voted for a measure that exempts States in East Coast, West Coast, and Rocky Mountain region from ethanol mandate, while leaving mandate in place in Midwest. [2003 Senate Vote 207, 6/5/2003]

 

2003: McCain Voted Against Requiring Gasoline Refineries To Use 5 Billions Gallons Of Ethanol Or Other Alternative Renewable Fuels Annually By 2012. McCain voted against an amendment that would require gasoline refineries to use 5 billion gallons of ethanol or other alternative renewable fuels annually by 2012, phase out the use of methyl tertiary butyl ether (MTBE) and eliminate a requirement that gasoline sold in regions with high levels of air pollution contain 2 percent oxygen by volume. [2003 Senate Vote 209, 6/5/2003]

 

2003: McCain Voted Against The 2003 Energy Bill. McCain voted against passage of a bill to overhaul the nation's energy policies, restructure the electricity system and provide for approximately $15 billion in energy-related tax incentives. It also would direct the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) to set a new CAFE standard within 15 months to two years. It would encourage the use of alternative energy and require utilities to increase their reliance on renewable fuels. [2003 Senate Vote 317, 7/31/2003]

 

2004: McCain Voted Against Phasing Out MBTE And Establishing Renewable Fuel Standards. McCain voted a measure that would require that gasoline sold in or introduced into the United States contain renewable fuel in specific amounts, beginning with 3.1 billion gallons in 2005 and increasing each year to 5 billion gallons in 2012. [2004 Senate Vote 73, 4/29/2004]

 

2005: McCain Voted Against Requiring Refiners To Use Renewable Fuels Like Ethanol And Phasing Out The Use OF MTBE. McCain voted to kill an amendment that would require refiners to annually use 8 billion gallons of renewable fuels by 2012, grant liability protection for ethanol manufacturers, phase out the use of the gasoline additive methyl tertiary butyl ether and eliminate the oxygen content requirement for reformulated gasoline. [2005 Senate Vote 138, 6/15/2005]

 

2005: McCain Voted Against An Amendment Requiring Refiners To Annually Use 8 Billion Gallons Of Renewable Fuels By 2012, Grant Ethanol Manufacturers Liability Protection, And To Phase Out The Use Of Methyl Tertiary Butyl Ether (MTBE) As An Additive. McCain voted against an amendment that would require refiners to annually use 8 billion gallons of renewable fuels by 2012, grant liability protection for ethanol manufacturers, phase out the use of the gasoline additive methyl tertiary butyl ether and eliminate the oxygen content requirement for reformulated gasoline. [2005 Senate Vote 139, 6/15/2005]

 

2005: McCain Voted Against Renewable Energy Mandate. McCain voted against an amendment that would mandate that renewable energy sources must produce at least 10 percent of the electricity sold by electric utilities by 2020, a minimum of 2.5 percent must be produced beginning 2008 through 2011. [2005 Senate Vote 141, 6/16/2005]

 

2005: McCain Voted Against Major Energy Legislation Providing $18 Billion In Energy Related Tax Incentives. McCain Voted Against The 2005 Energy Bill that Contributed to a Dramatic Increase in Wind Power. McCain voted against the Energy Policy Act of 2005. [2005 Senate Vote 213, 7/29/05]

 

2005: McCain Voted With Senate Republicans To Slash $20 Million from Renewable Energy and Energy Efficiency Program for Farmers. McCain voted for a budget package that almost entirely eliminated the popular and successful Renewable Energy and Energy Efficiency program for farmers, cutting it from its current $23 million to only $3 million. The Energy Efficiency program had doled out more than $66 million in grants for 400 clean energy projects in Rural America since 2003, including ethanol plants. These projects, valued at over one billion dollars, include bio-energy projects, wind power, and energy efficiency improvements. [2005 Senate Vote 363, 12/21/2005; "Senate Passes Deficit Reduction Act Of 2005: Renewable Energy Programs Cut," Environmental and Energy Institute, 12/19/05]

 

2006: McCain Voted Against Extending The Renewable Energy Production Credit; The Measure Also Included $290 Million For Renewable Energy R&D On Solar, Wind, Geothermal, Biomass, Hydropower. McCain voted against an amendment that provided an additional $500 million for LIHEAP and $3.5 billion for other energy programs. The amendment extends the renewable energy production tax credit and clean renewable energy bonds programs for four years. The amendment provided for the following funding: Biomass cellulosic fuels ($250 million), Cellulosic biomass ethanol conversion assistance ($250 million), Renewable energy R&D Solar, wind, geothermal, biomass, hydropower ($290 million). [2006 Senate Vote 42, 3/14/2006]

 

 

DEBATE REALITY CHECK: HEALTH CARE

Tonight Sarah Palin said: “[John McCain] he has a good health care plan that is detailed. I want to give you a couple details on that. He is proposing a five billion dollar tax credit for families so they can get out there and purchase their own health care coverage 5,000 tax credit, that is budget neutral. That doesn't cost the government anything as opposed to Barack Obama's plan to mandate health care coverage and have this universal government-run program, and unless you are pleased with the way that the Federal Government has been running anything lately, I don't think that is going to be real pleasing for Americans to consider health care being taken over by the Feds. But a $5,000 health care credit through our income tax, that's budget neutral, that's going to help, and he also wants to erase those artificial lines between states so that through competition, we can cross state lines, and if there is a better plan offered somewhere else, we would be able to purchase that. So affordability and accessibility will be the keys there with that $5,000 tax credit also being offered.†[Vice Presidential Debate, 10/2/08]

 

The Facts: McCain’s health care plan would raise taxes on middle class families. Obama’s plan is not government run and would maintain the existing system.

 

FACT: MCCAIN WOULD RAISE HEALTH CARE TAXES ON MIDDLE CLASS FAMILIES AND CAUSE 20 MILLION TO LOSE THEIR HEALTH CARE THROUGH THEIR EMPLOYERS

 

· McCain’s Campaign “Acknowledged†That His Health Care Plan “Would Have The Effect Of Increasing Tax Payments For Some Workers.†“Though Senator John McCain has promised to not raise taxes, his campaign acknowledged Wednesday that the health plan he outlined this week would have the effect of increasing tax payments for some workers, primarily those with high incomes and expensive health plans. … Douglas Holtz-Eakin said in an interview that for some, Mr. McCain’s health care tax credits would not be large enough to compensate for his proposal to eliminate the tax breaks afforded to workers with employer-provided health benefits.†[New York Times, 5/1/08 ]

 

· 20 Million Americans Would Lose Employment-Based Health Insurance Under The McCain Plan. “A study coming out Tuesday from scholars at Columbia, Harvard, Purdue and Michigan projects that 20 million Americans who have employment-based health insurance would lose it under the McCain plan. … According to the study: ‘The McCain plan will force millions of Americans into the weakest segment of the private insurance system — the nongroup market — where cost-sharing is high, covered services are limited and people will lose access to benefits they have now.’ The net effect of the plan, the study said, ‘almost certainly will be to increase family costs for medical care.’†[Herbert, New York Times, 9/16/08 ]

 

· Because McCain’s Health Care Tax Credit Is Indexed To “Regular Inflation,†Which Is Lower Than Annual Increase In Health Care Costs, After Four Years “The Number Of Uninsured Would… Creep Upward.†“Eliminating the tax exclusion, they wrote, ‘would greatly reduce the number of people who obtain health insurance through their employers.’ They put that figure at 20 million, and calculated that it would be offset at first by the 21 million who would be able to afford individual coverage using Mr. McCain’s tax credits. Within a few years, however, the trend would reverse, the study asserts. That is because, according to Mr. Holtz-Eakin, the McCain health care tax credits would be indexed to ‘regular inflation,’ presumably the Consumer Price Index, which is typically lower than annual increases in health care costs. Unless costs can be substantially reined in, the credits would therefore enable fewer people to afford coverage each year, leading to an eventual rise in the number of uninsured. … The estimates in Health Affairs are comparable to those made in July by the Urban Institute and Brookings Institution, which projected that 1 million people would gain coverage after one year under Mr. McCain’s plan, that almost 5 million people would gain coverage after four years, and that the number of uninsured would then creep upward.†[New York Times, 9/16/08 ]

 

· Wall Street Journal: McCain Plan Would “Allow Health-Insurance Companies to Escape State Regulations They Don't Like.†“Sen. McCain also would let people buy health insurance across state lines. That would allow health-insurance companies to escape state regulations they don't like, such as rules allowing for appeals when companies deny coverage and rules requiring insurers to cover people with various conditions or to cover particular types of treatments. The companies would likely gravitate to the states with the regulations they most favored. The result is that health-insurance companies would all operate out of states with few regulations, effectively stripping state rules built over decades, [Elizabeth] Edwards said. ‘We can expect all our health-care policies to be written in states where little is required of them.’†[Wall Street Journal , 4/19/08]

 

· Commonwealth Fund Study: McCain’s Plan Would Cost $185 Billion In The First Year While Obama’s Plan Would Cost $86 Billion in the first year. According to a report by the Commonwealth Fund, “McCain's plan would reduce the number of uninsured Americans by 1.3 million over the coming decade at a total cost of $1.3 billion. Obama's plan would reduce the ranks of the uninsured by 34 million at a cost of $1.63 billion. During the first year of implementation, McCain's proposed plan would dent the federal budget to the tune of $185 billion, while Obama's plan would require $86 billion.†[Washington Post, 10/2/08 ]

 

FACT: OBAMA’S PLAN IS NOT GOVERNMENT RUN

 

· Washington Post: McCain Repeats "Canard" That Obama’s Health Care Plan Would Turn The System Over To The Federal Government. "John McCain raised an old Republican canard, repeated often in the primaries, when he claimed that Obama's health care plan would eventually turn the health care system over to the federal government. The Illinois senator proposes helping individuals purchase health insurance through a system of subsidies and tax credits. He is also in favor of mandatory health insurance for children. But he is not advocating a state-run health system, such as the one that exists in Britain and some European countries. Under the Obama plan, individuals will still be free to choose between different types of health insurance, and will be able to choose their own doctors." [Washington Post Fact Check, 9/26/08 ]

· Fact Check.org: “Obama’s Plan Wouldn’t ‘Force’ Families Into A ‘Government Run Health Care System.’†“Furthermore, Obama’s plan wouldn’t ‘force’ families into a ‘government-run health care system.’ His plan mandates that children have coverage; there’s no mandate for adults. People can keep the health insurance they have now or chose from private plans, or opt for a new public plan that will offer coverage similar to what members of Congress have. Obama would also expand Medicaid and the State Children’s Health Insurance Program. His plan certainly expands government-offered insurance – and McCain’s doesn’t – but it’s not a solely government-run plan, as McCain implied. And if Obama's public plan turns out to be similar to what federal employees have, as he says it would be, we're not sure how "a bureaucrat" would stand ‘between you and your doctor.’†[Factcheck.org, 9/5/08 ]

· Joe Klein: When McCain Says Obama Favors A “Government-Run Health-Care System, He’s Not Telling The Truth.†Joe Klein at Time wrote, “When McCain says, for example, that Barack Obama favors a government-run health-care system, he's not telling the truth — Obama wants a market-based system subsidized by the government…†[Time, 9/17/08 ]

 

· McCain Has Repeatedly Suggested That His Democratic Rivals Are Proposing A Nationalized Health Care System And That Suggestion Is “Incorrect.†The New York Times wrote, “Senator John McCain has been repeatedly suggesting that his Democratic rivals are proposing a single-payer, or even a nationalized health care system along the lines of those in countries like Canada and Britain. The suggestion is incorrect. While both Senator Barack Obama of Illinois and Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton of New York are calling for universal health care and an expanded role for government, they stop well short of calling for a single-payer plan.†[New York Times, 5/3/08 ]

 

FACT: OBAMA’S PLAN WOULD MAINTAIN THE EXISTING PRIVATE SYSTEM

 

· Obama’s Plan Would Maintain The Existing Private System And Give Consumers The Option Of Buying Insurance From The Federal Government Along The Lines Of Medicare. Obama “would maintain the existing private system, providing government subsidies or tax credits to help the low-income uninsured afford premiums.†Obama would also “give consumers a new option to buy insurance from the federal government, with policies along the lines of Medicare.†[New York Times, 5/3/08 ]

 

· Commonwealth Fund Study: Obama’s Plan Has The Best Chance Of Making Health Care More Affordable, Accessible, Efficient And Higher In Quality; McCain’s Plan Would Only Cover 2 Million Of the Projected 67 Million Uninsured While Obama’s Plan Would Cover 34 Million. “An analysis of the two starkly different approaches to reforming the U.S. health care system offered by John McCain and Barack Obama suggests Obama's plan has the best chance of making health care more affordable, accessible, efficient and higher in quality. The report, released on Thursday by the Commonwealth Fund, sized up the presidential candidates' plans for dealing with a health care system which has left nearly 46 million people uninsured and many more underinsured.†[Reuters, 10/2/08 ]

 

[RNG187]

hippie, i love you.

[mrsdd]

We need to stop and ask the voters of this country what it is they REALLY want. Do they want “change†no matter what? Change from what? From paralysis in Washington? Self-interest before Country?

Okay.

 

I can buy that. Totally understandable. Washington’s a mess.

 

But…..

 

Something everyone needs to stop and think about, pull back and look at very long and hard. If you want to cure a disease, shouldn’t you attack the cause?

 

If you treat something that isn’t causing what you’re trying to cure, and if you take the wrong medicine, without reading the warning label, you’re more likely to make things worse, not better. Don’t you think?

 

We’re essentially, as a nation (depending on who’s doing the math and whether or not you include Social Security), bankrupt. We owe far more than we can reasonably pay back before our grandchildren have grandchildren, even if we started today. We’re UNDER WATER as a nation, financially.

 

So, the solution is to throw gasoline on the fire?

 

We look to Barack Obama, of all the most unlikely people, to save our economy? Based on what? His background? Experience? Demonstrated expertise in economics? His plan? What is his plan? Have you read the label? All of it?

 

You don’t stop a patient from bleeding by slicing off another arm or opening an artery! You don’t cure a deficit by printing (borrowing — somebody has to buy the bonds) more money. You don’t INCREASE the value of your currency by printing more mountains of it. Ask Brazil. Ask the Roman Empire.

 

Barack Obama’s version of “voodoo economics†— pouring money into social programs and expanding a non-earning welfare state (having the government spend itself out of bankruptcy(?)) while taxing small business, medium business, large business and every possible investment dollar you can get your hands on, to squeeze capital out of the economy and mail it out to people who are basically sitting on the porch waiting for the mail?

 

This is economics? It’s actually insanity. Running into the wall twice as fast this time, thinking it will hurt less? I’m not even sure there is an economic definition that fits this excuse for a plan.

 

I’d assume it’s at least supposed to be socialist, which is Barack Obama’s background and the root of all his past endeavors (endeavors, not accomplishments, of which he has, literally, none).

 

But, that’s not the biggest problem. I don’t think we’re all longing for a socialist nation. But, even if we were, even brilliant socialists have to have some wealth to re-distribute. How do you squeeze the life out of your economy and, at the same time, find another TRILLION dollars (or so) of spending to toss onto the creaking cart of the American economy? That is a feat no economist has ever imagined, even while stoned in the 60’s, much less endorsed.

 

Is nobody aware that 100 leading economists, including Nobel winners, have signed a statement that Barack Obama’s economic fairy tale is essentially nuts? Do supporters of “Our Man at Any Cost to Our Nation†really want us to turn into a South American mess with 50% inflation rates? Do they really want their savings, already cut in half, to evaporate altogether?

 

I’ve talked to people who believe we’re still on the gold standard. And when I explain that we aren’t on any standard, that our currency is tied to nothing at all, they nod as if they understand that and say it’s probably okay, we can’t just print money. After all, there’s the Federal Reserve and all those people. I’m not kidding. And some of these people are planning to (or were before I talked to them) vote for Obama because they had “heard†somewhere (on CNN most likely) that he was “supposed†to be better for the economy. As Hillary once said, “Get serious.â€

 

Even Alice would not believe this version of Wonderland. Do people have the foggiest notion of what they’re buying into?

 

I have a message for these folks. This is a capitalist country. Without capitalism, we don’t exist. And, without capital, there is no capitalism.

 

Is that simple enough? Printing money and handing it out does not create capital. It does not employ people. It does not create “opportunity†to earn, as opposed to “opportunity†to get a check in the mail. Nothing will drive investment and growth other than the pursuit of opportunity. You can’t “buy†a productive economy with government play money, which is what our currency is fast becoming.

 

But, that is what this “good for the economy†voodoo candidate — this “stealth†candidate who won’t even tell you what COURSES he studied in college, what his senior thesis was about, where he lived, or the name of a single college friend — is all about. If you listen. In the rare moments when he stands still long enough to take a stand that lasts longer than 24 hours, that’s what he’s saying.

 

But, to hear him, you have to actually listen.

 

I know there are people being interviewed on the street who think Governor Sarah Palin is Obama’s VP candidate and believe he’s Pro-Life and wants to stay in Iraq. But all of his supporters can’t possibly be that ignorant of the issues and what he stands for.

 

Even though he changes positions daily, he’s consistently calling for handouts to non-taxpayers, and tax credits for everything under the sun, while doubling taxes on actual investment and small businesses and any rich people who haven’t moved to Switzerland already.

 

There is a fundamental misunderstanding driving all of this. It’s a colossal mistake. And I can’t believe it’s intentional, as much as I’d like to paint all the “that ones†as evil. They’re not. I don’t believe that. I used to be over there on that side of the aisle. But, they are caught up in some kind of rapture that is clouding their thinking.

 

Here’s the mistake, conceptually.

 

Let’s call it the “Pendulum Theory†for sake of illustration. Put a pendulum on any upright, stationary object. A stick in the ground, if that’s simple enough. Attach a pendulum to the top of it.

 

Swing it back and forth.

 

Trust me, stability does NOT lie at the opposite extremes of the pendulum. It lies in the middle.

 

To take out your frustration at one end of the pendulum by swinging it as far as you can in the other direction is not the way to do anything other than topple the stick. That stick is the United States.

People are angry. Rightfully so.

 

About the economy. Okay. Should be about a lot of things — this Congress hasn’t seen the sunshine in a long time (meaning their head has been somewhere very dark), with regard to a lot of issues, not solely the economy. The “leadership†of the majority party has spent most of its time with its tongue out, playing nah nah nah nah boo boo with the President and making the Keystone Cops look like a well-oiled law enforcement machine.

 

They (along with some ideologues here) should all take jobs during hunting season as bird dogs because all they’ve really become good at is “pointing.â€

 

But to turn into an angry mob and invite the extreme left wing of the (formerly) Democrat Party to come in and throw a toga party with the treasury, to take from the rich (actually not just the rich, but that’s what they tell you) and hand it to the less rich, to swing the pendulum past the other extreme, to shatter the meaning of extreme, is hardly the answer.

 

Where has the nation prospered? In the middle.

 

Bill Clinton came out of the Democratic Leadership Council, specifically dedicated to moving the Democrat Party back toward the center of the country. Like him or don’t, we were paying our bills.

 

John McCain has been hampered, within his own party, because he’s considered too far to the center for the conservative wing of the GOP. Governor Palin has helped smooth out that intra-party dynamic and, together, they make a balanced team. But, John McCain is not a right-wing ideologue. And he’s proved it over and over for over 25 years.

 

Do we really want to let our anger and our spite and our vitriol lead us to swing the political pendulum so hard that it snaps off and we all have to learn Chinese (who do you think owns our paper)?

 

If Barack Obama and his band of cronies actually ran under the banner of the Social Democrat Party, or the New Socialist Party, or the Social Progressives Party, or the Independent Workers Party or, to be more precise, the ASP (the “American Socialist Partyâ€), would the masses still be whipping themselves into a frenzy and writing children’s marching songs to his glory?

 

Because that’s what this movement is, if you look behind the curtain, without the title.

 

The Democrat Party is not the party of the DLC any longer, if it ever was. It was handed over to Howard “Screaming†Dean, I suppose because people thought he knew about the Internet and would bring the moveon.org money tree with him. What they forgot was, he was also bringing himself with him. Again, know what you’re buying.

 

The Democrat Party is no longer a party of Democrats. It has become the party of thugs. Left wing storm troopers. And, with the aid of the compliant media wanna-be intelligentsia (in the process making a lie of the term itself), it has become the party of radical extremism fueled by self-aggrandizing delusion.

 

It is the party of kids who jump up and down at a rally and can’t tell you what Roe v. Wade is though their leaders throw it in the face of any female who might consider voting for the other side; the party of Donna Brazile, who doesn’t think gays or lesbian discrimination is really serious, reserving discrimination for only blacks, so Whoopie Goldberg won’t be in fear of being made a slave by John McCain; the party that thinks it’s just fine to call the opposing Vice Presidential nominee, the most popular Governor in America, a C*** with a giggle and a snicker; the party of ranting Black Liberation or Black Nationalist theology, depending on who’s talking about it (Obama in his post Million Man March remarks used Black Nationalism but we’re not allowed to mention anything he’s ever said because he’s not required to mean what he says or say what he means); the party of “in your face†street politics, intimidating voters, overrunning caucuses to get the most votes, no matter who the public might actually favor; the party to discard the National Anthem, to find a new flag that other people in unfriendly nations will find less offensive to them; the party that will stop being so darn difficult and sit down for a fireside chat with extremists (who are gathering forces and developing nuclear weapons to wipe their enemies from the face of the earth) so they can tell us what we can do to make them happy and make them like us again (hint: they never liked us); the party that thinks reaching across the aisle means keeping a knife in the other hand, in case of an opening (remember the Clinton primary, Obama’s comment about Chicago politics and Hillary Clinton — “If they bring knives, we’ll bring guns?â€).

 

This is not what’s in the big, pretty ad with the smiling people and the uplifting music. This is what’s in the not-so-fine print. This is what you’re buying. And, when the election’s over and you get the pretty package home and open it up, don’t be surprised if it contains a Chinese dictionary and an envelope telling you where to send your “patriotic contribution†to the “freedom payments†going to your fellow citizens, along with a sign up card for your child’s Summer at Patriot Camp.

 

 

[CDBS14]

i wont even quote but that post is massive.

[HippieChik]

-Wu-Mrs.D.D. ]

His plan? What is his plan?

 

Well, for starters:

 

Barack Obama and Joe Biden's Plan

Jumpstart the Economy

Enact a Windfall Profits Tax to Provide a $1,000 Emergency Energy Rebate to American Families:Barack Obama and Joe Biden will enact a windfall profits tax on excessive oil company profits to give American families an immediate $1,000 emergency energy rebate to help families pay rising bills. This relief would be a down payment on the Obama-Biden long-term plan to provide middle-class families with at least $1,000 per year in permanent tax relief.

Provide $50 billion to Jumpstart the Economy and Prevent 1 Million Americans from Losing Their Jobs: This relief would include a $25 billion State Growth Fund to prevent state and local cuts in health, education, housing, and heating assistance or counterproductive increases in property taxes, tolls or fees. The Obama-Biden relief plan will also include $25 billion in a Jobs and Growth Fund to prevent cutbacks in road and bridge maintenance and fund school re­pair - all to save more than 1 million jobs in danger of being cut.

 

Provide Middle Class Americans Tax Relief

Obama and Biden will cut income taxes by $1,000 for working families to offset the payroll tax they pay.

 

Provide a Tax Cut for Working Families: Obama and Biden will restore fairness to the tax code and provide 150 million workers the tax relief they need. Obama and Biden will create a new "Making Work Pay" tax credit of up to $500 per person, or $1,000 per working family. The "Making Work Pay" tax credit will completely eliminate income taxes for 10 million Americans.

Eliminate Income Taxes for Seniors Making Less than $50,000: Barack Obama will eliminate all income taxation of seniors making less than $50,000 per year. This proposal will eliminate income taxes for 7 million seniors and provide these seniors with an average savings of $1,400 each year. Under the Obama-Biden plan, 27 million American seniors will also not need to file an income tax return.

Simplify Tax Filings for Middle Class Americans: Obama and Biden will dramatically simplify tax filings so that millions of Americans will be able to do their taxes in less than five minutes. Obama and Biden will ensure that the IRS uses the information it already gets from banks and employers to give taxpayers the option of pre-filled tax forms to verify, sign and return. Experts estimate that the Obama-Biden proposal will save Americans up to 200 million total hours of work and aggravation and up to $2 billion in tax preparer fees.

 

Trade

Obama and Biden believe that trade with foreign nations should strengthen the American economy and create more American jobs. He will stand firm against agreements that undermine our economic security.

 

Fight for Fair Trade: Obama and Biden will fight for a trade policy that opens up foreign markets to support good American jobs. They will use trade agreements to spread good labor and environmental standards around the world and stand firm against agreements like the Central American Free Trade Agreement that fail to live up to those important benchmarks. Obama and Biden will also pressure the World Trade Organization to enforce trade agreements and stop countries from continuing unfair government subsidies to foreign exporters and nontariff barriers on U.S. exports.

Amend the North American Free Trade Agreement: Obama and Biden believe that NAFTA and its potential were oversold to the American people. They will work with the leaders of Canada and Mexico to fix NAFTA so that it works for American workers.

Improve Transition Assistance: To help all workers adapt to a rapidly changing economy, Obama and Biden will update the existing system of Trade Adjustment Assistance by extending it to service industries, creating flexible education accounts to help workers retrain, and providing retraining assistance for workers in sectors of the economy vulnerable to dislocation before they lose their jobs.

End Tax Breaks for Companies that Send Jobs Overseas: Barack Obama and Joe Biden believe that companies should not get billions of dollars in tax deductions for moving their operations overseas. Obama and Biden will also fight to ensure that public contracts are awarded to companies that are committed to American workers.

Reward Companies that Support American Workers: Barack Obama introduced the Patriot Employer Act of 2007 with Senators Richard Durbin (D-IL) and Sherrod Brown (D-OH) to reward companies that create good jobs with good benefits for American workers. The legislation would provide a tax credit to companies that maintain or increase the number of full-time workers in America relative to those outside the US; maintain their corporate headquarters in America if it has ever been in America; pay decent wages; prepare workers for retirement; provide health insurance; and support employees who serve in the military.

 

Invest in the Manufacturing Sector and Create 5 Million New Green Jobs

Invest in our Next Generation Innovators and Job Creators: Obama and Biden will create an Advanced Manufacturing Fund to identify and invest in the most compelling advanced manufacturing strategies. The Fund will have a peer-review selection and award process based on the Michigan 21st Century Jobs Fund, a state-level initiative that has awarded over $125 million to Michigan businesses with the most innovative proposals to create new products and new jobs in the state.

Double Funding for the Manufacturing Extension Partnership: The Manufacturing Extension Partnership (MEP) works with manufacturers across the country to improve efficiency, implement new technology and strengthen company growth. This highly-successful program has engaged in more than 350,000 projects across the country and in 2006 alone, helped create and protect over 50,000 jobs. But despite this success, funding for MEP has been slashed by the Bush administration. Barack Obama and Joe Biden will double funding for the MEP so its training centers can continue to bolster the competitiveness of U.S. manufacturers.

Invest In A Clean Energy Economy And Create 5 Million New Green Jobs: Obama and Biden will invest $150 billion over 10 years to advance the next generation of biofuels and fuel infrastructure, accelerate the commercialization of plug-in hybrids, promote development of commercial scale renewable energy, invest in low emissions coal plants, and begin transition to a new digital electricity grid. The plan will also invest in America's highly-skilled manufacturing workforce and manufacturing centers to ensure that American workers have the skills and tools they need to pioneer the first wave of green technologies that will be in high demand throughout the world.

Create New Job Training Programs for Clean Technologies: The Obama-Biden plan will increase funding for federal workforce training programs and direct these programs to incorporate green technologies training, such as advanced manufacturing and weatherization training, into their efforts to help Americans find and retain stable, high-paying jobs. Obama and Biden will also create an energy-focused youth jobs program to invest in disconnected and disadvantaged youth.

Boost the Renewable Energy Sector and Create New Jobs: The Obama-Biden plan will create new federal policies, and expand existing ones, that have been proven to create new American jobs. Obama and Biden will create a federal Renewable Portfolio Standard (RPS) that will require 25 percent of American electricity be derived from renewable sources by 2025, which has the potential to create hundreds of thousands of new jobs on its own. Obama and Biden will also extend the Production Tax Credit, a credit used successfully by American farmers and investors to increase renewable energy production and create new local jobs.

 

New Jobs Through National Infrastructure Investment

Barack Obama and Joe Biden believe that it is critically important for the United States to rebuild its national transportation infrastructure – its highways, bridges, roads, ports, air, and train systems – to strengthen user safety, bolster our long-term competitiveness and ensure our economy continues to grow.

 

Create a National Infrastructure Reinvestment Bank: Barack Obama and Joe Biden will address the infrastructure challenge by creating a National Infrastructure Reinvestment Bank to expand and enhance, not supplant, existing federal transportation investments. This independent entity will be directed to invest in our nation’s most challenging transportation infrastructure needs. The Bank will receive an infusion of federal money, $60 billion over 10 years, to provide financing to transportation infrastructure projects across the nation. These projects will create up to two million new direct and indirect jobs and stimulate approximately $35 billion per year in new economic activity.

 

Technology, Innovation and Creating Jobs

Barack Obama and Joe Biden will increase federal support for research, technology and innovation for companies and universities so that American families can lead the world in creating new advanced jobs and products.

 

Invest in the Sciences: Barack Obama and Joe Biden support doubling federal funding for basic research and changing the posture of our federal government from being one of the most anti-science administrations in American history to one that embraces science and technology. This will foster home-grown innovation, help ensure the competitiveness of US technology-based businesses, and ensure that 21st century jobs can and will grow in America.

Make the Research and Development Tax Credit Permanent: Barack Obama and Joe Biden want investments in a skilled research and development workforce and technology infrastructure to be supported here in America so that American workers and communities will benefit. Obama and Biden want to make the Research and Development tax credit permanent so that firms can rely on it when making decisions to invest in domestic R&D over multi-year timeframes.

Deploy Next-Generation Broadband: Barack Obama and Joe Biden believe we can get broadband to every community in America through a combination of reform of the Universal Service Fund, better use of the nation's wireless spectrum, promotion of next-generation facilities, technologies and applications, and new tax and loan incentives.

 

Support Small Business

Provide Tax Relief for Small Businesses and Start Up Companies: Barack Obama and Joe Biden will eliminate all capital gains taxes on start-up and small businesses to encourage innovation and job creation. Obama and Biden will also support small business owners by providing a $500 “Making Work Pay†tax credit to almost every worker in America. Self-employed small business owners pay both the employee and the employer side of the payroll tax, and this measure will reduce the burdens of this double taxation.

Create a National Network of Public-Private Business Incubators: Barack Obama and Joe Biden will support entrepreneurship and spur job growth by creating a national network of public-private business incubators. Business incubators facilitate the critical work of entrepreneurs in creating start-up companies. Obama and Biden will invest $250 million per year to increase the number and size of incubators in disadvantaged communities throughout the country.

 

Labor

Obama and Biden will strengthen the ability of workers to organize unions. He will fight for passage of the Employee Free Choice Act. Obama and Biden will ensure that his labor appointees support workers' rights and will work to ban the permanent replacement of striking workers. Obama and Biden will also increase the minimum wage and index it to inflation to ensure it rises every year.

 

Ensure Freedom to Unionize: Obama and Biden believe that workers should have the freedom to choose whether to join a union without harassment or intimidation from their employers. Obama cosponsored and is strong advocate for the Employee Free Choice Act, a bipartisan effort to assure that workers can exercise their right to organize. He will continue to fight for EFCA's passage and sign it into law.

Fight Attacks on Workers' Right to Organize: Obama has fought the Bush National Labor Relations Board (NLRB) efforts to strip workers of their right to organize. He is a cosponsor of legislation to overturn the NLRB's "Kentucky River" decisions classifying hundreds of thousands of nurses, construction, and professional workers as "supervisors" who are not protected by federal labor laws.

Protect Striking Workers: Obama and Biden support the right of workers to bargain collectively and strike if necessary. They will work to ban the permanent replacement of striking workers, so workers can stand up for themselves without worrying about losing their livelihoods.

Raise the Minimum Wage: Barack Obama and Joe Biden will raise the minimum wage, index it to inflation and increase the Earned Income Tax Credit to make sure that full-time workers earn a living wage that allows them to raise their families and pay for basic needs.

 

Protect Homeownership and Crack Down on Mortgage Fraud

Obama and Biden will crack down on fraudulent brokers and lenders. They will also make sure homebuyers have honest and complete information about their mortgage options, and they will give a tax credit to all middle-class homeowners.

 

Create a Universal Mortgage Credit: Obama and Biden will create a 10 percent universal mortgage credit to provide homeowners who do not itemize tax relief. This credit will provide an average of $500 to 10 million homeowners, the majority of whom earn less than $50,000 per year.

Ensure More Accountability in the Subprime Mortgage Industry: Obama has been closely monitoring the subprime mortgage situation for years, and introduced comprehensive legislation over a year ago to fight mortgage fraud and protect consumers against abusive lending practices. Obama's STOP FRAUD Act provides the first federal definition of mortgage fraud, increases funding for federal and state law enforcement programs, creates new criminal penalties for mortgage professionals found guilty of fraud, and requires industry insiders to report suspicious activity.

Mandate Accurate Loan Disclosure: Obama and Biden will create a Homeowner Obligation Made Explicit (HOME) score, which will provide potential borrowers with a simplified, standardized borrower metric (similar to APR) for home mortgages. The HOME score will allow individuals to easily compare various mortgage products and understand the full cost of the loan.

Close Bankruptcy Loophole for Mortgage Companies: Obama and Biden will work to eliminate the provision that prevents bankruptcy courts from modifying an individual's mortgage payments. They believe that the subprime mortgage industry, which has engaged in dangerous and sometimes unscrupulous business practices, should not be shielded by outdated federal law.

 

Address Predatory Credit Card Practices

Obama and Biden will establish a five-star rating system so that every consumer knows the risk involved in every credit card. They also will establish a Credit Card Bill of Rights to stop credit card companies from exploiting consumers with unfair practices.

 

Create a Credit Card Rating System to Improve Disclosure: Obama and Biden will create a credit card rating system, modeled on five-star systems used for other consumer products, to provide consumers an easily identifiable ranking of credit cards, based on the card's features. Credit card companies will be required to display the rating on all application and contract materials, enabling consumers to quickly understand all of the major provisions of a credit card without having to rely exclusively on fine print in lengthy documents.

Establish a Credit Card Bill of Rights to Protect Consumers: Obama and Biden will create a Credit Card Bill of Rights to protect consumers. The Obama-Biden plan will:

Ban Unilateral Changes

Apply Interest Rate Increases Only to Future Debt

Prohibit Interest on Fees

Prohibit "Universal Defaults"

Require Prompt and Fair Crediting of Cardholder Payments

Reform Bankruptcy Laws

Obama and Biden will reform our bankruptcy laws to protect working people, ban executive bonuses for bankrupt companies, and require disclosure of all pension investments.

 

Cap Outlandish Interest Rates on Payday Loans and Improve Disclosure: Obama and Biden will extend a 36 percent interest cap to all Americans. They will require lenders to provide clear and simplified information about loan fees, payments and penalties, which is why they'll require lenders to provide this information during the application process.

Encourage Responsible Lending Institutions to Make Small Consumer Loans: Obama and Biden will encourage banks, credit unions and Community Development Financial Institutions to provide affordable short-term and small-dollar loans and to drive unscrupulous lenders out of business.

Reform Bankruptcy Laws to Protect Families Facing a Medical Crisis: Obama and Biden will create an exemption in bankruptcy law for individuals who can prove they filed for bankruptcy because of medical expenses. This exemption will create a process that forgives the debt and lets the individuals get back on their feet.

 

 

Work/Family Balance

Obama and Biden will double funding for after-school programs, expand the Family Medical Leave Act, provide low-income families with a refundable tax credit to help with their child-care expenses, and encourage flexible work schedules.

 

Expand the Family and Medical Leave Act: The FMLA covers only certain employees of employers with 50 or more employees. Obama and Biden will expand it to cover businesses with 25 or more employees. They will expand the FMLA to cover more purposes as well, including allowing workers to take leave for elder care needs; allowing parents up to 24 hours of leave each year to participate in their children's academic activities; and expanding FMLA to cover leave for employees to address domestic violence.

Encourage States to Adopt Paid Leave: As president, Obama will initiate a strategy to encourage all 50 states to adopt paid-leave systems. Obama and Biden will provide a $1.5 billion fund to assist states with start-up costs and to help states offset the costs for employees and employers.

Expand High-Quality Afterschool Opportunities: Obama and Biden will double funding for the main federal support for afterschool programs, the 21st Century Learning Centers program, to serve a million more children. Obama and Biden will include measures to maximize performance and effectiveness across grantees nationwide.

Expand the Child and Dependent Care Tax Credit: The Child and Dependent Care Tax Credit provides too little relief to families that struggle to afford child care expenses. Obama and Biden will reform the Child and Dependent Care Tax Credit by making it refundable and allowing low-income families to receive up to a 50 percent credit for their child care expenses.

Protect Against Caregiver Discrimination: Workers with family obligations often are discriminated against in the workplace. Obama and Biden will enforce the recently-enacted Equal Employment Opportunity Commission guidelines on caregiver discrimination.

Expand Flexible Work Arrangements: Obama and Biden will create a program to inform businesses about the benefits of flexible work schedules; help businesses create flexible work opportunities; and increase federal incentives for telecommuting. Obama and Biden will also make the federal government a model employer in terms of adopting flexible work schedules and permitting employees to request flexible arrangements.

 

Barack Obama's Record

Housing: In the U.S. Senate, Obama introduced the STOP FRAUD Act to increase penalties for mortgage fraud and provide more protections for low-income homebuyers, well before the current subprime crisis began.

Predatory Lending: In the Illinois State Senate, Obama called attention to predatory lending issues. Obama sponsored legislation to combat predatory payday loans, and he also was credited with lobbying the state to more closely regulate some of the most egregious predatory lending practices.

American Jobs: Barack Obama introduced the Patriot Employer Act of 2007 to provide a tax credit to companies that maintain or increase the number of full-time workers in America relative to those outside the US; maintain their corporate headquarters in America; pay decent wages; prepare workers for retirement; provide health insurance; and support employees who serve in the military.

[HippieChik]

RNG187 ]

hippie' date=' i love you.

[/quote']

 

[CDBS14]

HippieChik ]

RNG187 ]

hippie' date=' i love you.

[/quote']

 

 

wow, if i may ask, how did you pot all of that?

[STREETSWEEPR1]

SOCIALIST LIAR......

[WARPIG]

HippieChick!!!!!

 

 

Yjou get my applause gif!!!! LOL Where have you been in this thread? LOL

 

[HippieChik]

Where have you been in this thread? LOL

 

Quitely lurking. You know, the other day I received YET ANOTHER "Obama is a baby-eating blood drinking al qaeda scientologist born from the seed of Marx here to single handedly destroy the U.S from within anti-chist" and to be honest, I've had enough.

 

People are flat out, undeniably IGNORANT! They believe and decided their presidential vote on this sh*t! It is really pathethic and honestly makes me think that voting shouldn't be a right given to all people. You really should have to pass an intelligence test to vote. (And this even includes the folks in Harlem that were interviewed by someone on Howard Stern's show. If you are voting for a candidate because he is black. YOU ARE IGNORANT and should not be allowed to vote!)

 

So now, when I get one of those emails, I reply to everyone on the list letting them know that they shouldn't let a chain email influence their decision, think for yourself, research for yourself, decide for yourself. And then I attach FACTS that any person with half a brain can easily find if they take a little bit of time to search out the truth.

 

Of course, I get all kinds of responses, mostly ignorant. Even my own aunt could only say "Well, I don't support abortion and gays shouldn't marry so that's why I am voting McCain." Well, guess what I agree! I don't support abortion and I don't think gay marriage should be legal either, but right now, in the grand scheme of things, there are much bigger worries to take care of and if we don't handle it or elect someone to handle it, NONE of it will matter.

 

So, today, I logged on here to UF, caught up on this thread and had another "moment" and felt the need to share some REAL FACTS with REAL SOURCES.

[HippieChik]

CDBS14 ]

HippieChik ]

RNG187 ]

hippie' date=' i love you.

[/quote']

 

 

wow, if i may ask, how did you pot all of that?

 

Same way you post, with a computer and keyboard.

[CDBS14]

HippieChik ]

Where have you been in this thread? LOL

 

Quitely lurking. You know, the other day I received YET ANOTHER "Obama is a baby-eating blood drinking al qaeda scientologist born from the seed of Marx here to single handedly destroy the U.S from within anti-chist" and to be honest, I've had enough.

 

People are flat out, undeniably IGNORANT! They believe and decided their presidential vote on this sh*t! It is really pathethic and honestly makes me think that voting shouldn't be a right given to all people. You really should have to pass an intelligence test to vote. (And this even includes the folks in Harlem that were interviewed by someone on Howard Stern's show. If you are voting for a candidate because he is black. YOU ARE IGNORANT and should not be allowed to vote!)

 

So now, when I get one of those emails, I reply to everyone on the list letting them know that they shouldn't let a chain email influence their decision, think for yourself, research for yourself, decide for yourself. And then I attach FACTS that any person with half a brain can easily find if they take a little bit of time to search out the truth.

 

Of course, I get all kinds of responses, mostly ignorant. Even my own aunt could only say "Well, I don't support abortion and gays shouldn't marry so that's why I am voting McCain." Well, guess what I agree! I don't support abortion and I don't think gay marriage should be legal either, but right now, in the grand scheme of things, there are much bigger worries to take care of and if we don't handle it or elect someone to handle it, NONE of it will matter.

 

So, today, I logged on here to UF, caught up on this thread and had another "moment" and felt the need to share some REAL FACTS with REAL SOURCES.

 

 

YOU GO GIRL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[WARPIG]

HippieChik ]

Where have you been in this thread? LOL

 

Quitely lurking. You know, the other day I received YET ANOTHER "Obama is a baby-eating blood drinking al qaeda scientologist born from the seed of Marx here to single handedly destroy the U.S from within anti-chist" and to be honest, I've had enough.

 

People are flat out, undeniably IGNORANT! They believe and decided their presidential vote on this sh*t! It is really pathethic and honestly makes me think that voting shouldn't be a right given to all people. You really should have to pass an intelligence test to vote. (And this even includes the folks in Harlem that were interviewed by someone on Howard Stern's show. If you are voting for a candidate because he is black. YOU ARE IGNORANT and should not be allowed to vote!)

 

So now, when I get one of those emails, I reply to everyone on the list letting them know that they shouldn't let a chain email influence their decision, think for yourself, research for yourself, decide for yourself. And then I attach FACTS that any person with half a brain can easily find if they take a little bit of time to search out the truth.

 

Of course, I get all kinds of responses, mostly ignorant. Even my own aunt could only say "Well, I don't support abortion and gays shouldn't marry so that's why I am voting McCain." Well, guess what I agree! I don't support abortion and I don't think gay marriage should be legal either, but right now, in the grand scheme of things, there are much bigger worries to take care of and if we don't handle it or elect someone to handle it, NONE of it will matter.

 

So, today, I logged on here to UF, caught up on this thread and had another "moment" and felt the need to share some REAL FACTS with REAL SOURCES.

 

Yes, it is truly sad. I have been getting these type of chain letters from my parents who are staunch republicans. LOL I do the same. I make sure to "reply to all" and then give them an ear full! I'll never understand this brand of republican. It's not the Reagan era of republican that I grew up on. And now, down in the polls and getting desperate they've lowered themselves to "robo calling" where they link Obama to domestic terrorism and all sorts of BS. The same group that cost Johnny the election in 2000 no less!!! LOL

 

I'm just glad to see Obama and his campaign push back and push back HARD. The Ohio supreme court ruled against the republican trying to disenfranchise over 200K voters again this year! Pulling the same tactics from 2000 and 2004. Obama is on it this time. I agree that "ignorant" is the key word here. You hit the nail on the head.

 

Here's the last ditch effort by McCain:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OtRUWjf7MuE

 

 

PS: everyone should watch "Meet the Press" tomorrow... the rumor is that republican Colon Powwell is going to announce his support for Obama. This would be surely a nail in the coffin for the McCain camp IMO.

 

 

 

[mrsdd]

HippieChik ]

CDBS14 ]

HippieChik ]

RNG187 ]

hippie' date=' i love you.

[/quote']

 

 

wow, if i may ask, how did you pot all of that?

 

Same way you post, with a computer and keyboard.

 

 

its called copy and paste everything there is word for word from the obama website

[HogWild_101st]

-Wu-Mrs.D.D. ]

HippieChik ]

CDBS14 ]

HippieChik ]

RNG187 ]

hippie' date=' i love you.

[/quote']

 

 

wow, if i may ask, how did you pot all of that?

 

Same way you post, with a computer and keyboard.

 

 

its called copy and paste everything there is word for word from the obama website

 

oh no you didn't...... SNAP! LOL

 

[HippieChik]

-Wu-Mrs.D.D. ]

HippieChik ]

CDBS14 ]

HippieChik ]

RNG187 ]

hippie' date=' i love you.

[/quote']

 

 

wow, if i may ask, how did you pot all of that?

 

Same way you post, with a computer and keyboard.

 

 

its called copy and paste everything there is word for word from the obama website

 

REGARDLESS of where it came from, it is what it is. McCain's record isn't my fault. It's VERIFIABLE PROOF of how McCain voted, therefore what he stands for.

 

You're just mad that I posted REAL PROOF that tells the REAL STORY. Truth hurts ... :'(

 

*Thinks to self: And when they have no defense left or lies to hide behind, the mud slinging starts in true Johnny Mac fashion.*

 

 

[Guest SuddenRedScare]

Copy and paste... LOL!

[CDBS14]

LOL ISNT THAT WHAT YOU GUYS DO WHEN YOU POST ANTI-OBAMA LOL, COPY AND PASTE, LOL. i think that is called irony :o :o

[HogWild_101st]

Mad?

 

Oh yea, Obama is a bastion of truth.....

 

Said he would accept government campaign financing if McCain did, and then didn't.

 

Said he would debate McCain anytime anywhere, but refused to do so until forced by election laws.

 

Has whined that McCain should defend Michelle Obama when she recieves unfavorable press, but when McCain's wife recieves unfavorable press, Obama is silent, all 3 times it's happened.

 

Has lied about his stance of infantcide.

 

Has lied about his stance on guns.

 

His college transcripts are locked up like Fort Knox.

 

His work at the CAC is locked up like Fort Knox.

 

The fact is, when pressed, Obama lies to hide the truth. How anyone would think Obama cares about them when Obama has allowed his blood relatives in Kenya to live in poverty for years while he's writing books and becoming a millionaire is beyond me.

 

 

And no CDBS14, I have never pulled anything off the McCain campaign website, haven't used anything from Hannity or O'Reilly. I have used reputable news sources.