Covert-OPs_

SnowBud ]

Did you look online at the lobbies like I asked you too? If so you would see my point, im certainly not going to argue and go round and round with someone who demands proof. You want proof go find it yourself.

 

Who gives a hoot what the people at GB think, I don't. You point is that at GB they want a TPS ladder, thats awesome, I bet its not to replace the FPS ladder.

 

Bottom line I bet UF does both, if not their not going to replace what everyone wants with what a few want.

I did not play MW2 last night unfortunately. As far as providing proof is concerned, it's your prerogative to support your position with facts or not. My only issue with your portrayal is that you did not provide any facts. From my position all you have done is introduced your "feelings" into what sounded like a statement of fact. What you think and what is are two different things. Just like the segment of TOU that wants to play 3rd person, just because they like it better doesn't mean that everyone feels the same way. If you're insulted by my request for you to substantiate your claim or feel that I should do the leg work for you, then that's a problem for you to figure out not I.

My point isn't that the GB community wants a 3rd person ladder, rather that your statement below does not ring true for what I've been seeing.(FYI the vote for a 3rd person ladder on that site is now at 92.71% in favor of it although the vote count is still low overall)

SnowBud ]

I'm not talking about your clan or clans here im talking about the millions of people that have followed this game for years. If UF wants to grow into more than socom, it needs to support what the overwhelming majority want.

When you say "overwhelming majority" all I wanted to know was how you got to that conclusion. Is it your opinion that the "overwhelming majority" DO NOT want to play 3rd person or is it that you have statistical data that you've collected over a significant period of time to substantiate your claim?

At any rate I think there could be multiple events for this game. The developer has obviously given competitive gaming communities the opportunity to create different kinds of events(which is great). I have not once said that UF should not offer both or a mixture of both. If that is what you have understood from any of my posts then you should re-read them because that has not been stated.

*It's a basic debate strategy to mix statements of fact with opinions as to shape the direction of the discussion. Which is why I am a stickler in these kinds of discussions, if it's an opinion I like to know that clearly and if it's a fact I like to analyze it for myself. Which can be frustrating for some that try to do the above and I realize that. My intention is not to offend you, however I do realize it may annoy you.*

xLASTx ]

Fluid__ ]

xLASTx ]

in a private match turn FF on turn radar always on OFF an make it known theirs no 203' an rockets are for shooting machines only an your war is set up.

 

Ok there is a problem with this. Sentry guns. What if you shoot a sentry gun with an rpg right when it was planted and it kills the sentry gun planter? The gun is a machine.

 

Again if your rocket kills the planter your team forfeits i don't understand why this is a hard concept. If your rocket for any reason kills a member of the other team your team loses so there needs tobe a certain level of skill an care when your shooting at something not this whole everybody runs around shooting rockets off at each other madhouse. If your afraid your rocket will kill the sentry gun planter then just shot your gun or run up an knife it an covert's right maybe only stinger rockets should be allowed they only lock on to airsurport.

It isn't hard to understand, your original statement to not account for what I explained about "lock-on". Regardless, I do not agree with what you're saying, rockets and grenade launchers are two different animals. Using a rocket leaves you exposed for significantly longer than grenade launchers so you're taking a significant risk when equipping them. Furthermore, the trajectory of a rocket is very different than that of a grenade launcher which reduces it's effectiveness. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, I just happen to disagree with what yours on this matter.

I went back today to test "lock-on" and the Javelin allows you to lock on to any solid non-moving object, whereas the stinger does not. Just an FYI, I'd like to make sure I get my facts straight.

Why not make it so that the only rockets allowed are "lock-on" enabled rockets? I've tried every rocket in the game(while testing) and there are 3 that will not allow you to shoot at people. They require lock-ons, so if you ban the rest and allow those 3 then you're golden and you don't have any gray areas in that area. I still don't agree that all the other settings should remain the same but as far as rockets are concerned I think this should solve your problem.

SnowBud ]

Covert-OPs_ ]

SnowBud ]

I could see maybe a Horseman style 4v4 with the new TPS for COD but I am going to have to agree with CDB on this one. For tac map and black style I think it needs to be what the overwhelming majority of COD players play and its not the TPS mode. Especially if you truly want to see this place grow with COD players, people who aren't socom transplants don't play that mode period.

 

I'm not saying that you're wrong(yet) but I just don't understand how you can state something like this. Do you know for a FACT that "the overwhelming majority" of MW2 players are NOT playing 3rd person? If so could you please include the statistics and cite them?

 

If not then I don't see how you can even make a claim like that with any confidence.

 

Whether or not you believe me doesn't matter. The fact is this game has a following which is FPS its always been that way and I don't need to provide you anything to prove that. If you want to look for yourself in the online lobbies you can see how many players are playing each mode, that should be all the evidence you need.

 

I'm not talking about your clan or clans here im talking about the millions of people that have followed this game for years. If UF wants to grow into more than socom, it needs to support what the overwhelming majority want.

That's my exact point, it shouldn't be about believing you. I'm asking you for facts to back up what only sounds like an opinion up to this point. I do agree that COD's roots are in the FPS genre(I would have to be a fool not to) but some of your statements up to this point have been matters of opinions represented as facts. If you're going to do that then 10 times out of 10 I'll ask you to prove it. Whether you want to or not is a different story, I'm just trying to get the facts and not get mired down in what people "think" is popular or unpopular.

In an effort to collect some data I created a poll on the GB forums asking whether or not there should be a 3rd person ladder. So far 85% of the votes are for a 3rd person ladder(there aren't that many total votes yet). Every community is different and some could make the argument that GB has some of the most hardcore gamers around because of their professional affiliation to MLG. I think that could serve as a litmus test to how some of the hardcore MW2 fans think about the evolving franchise. Anyway, most of my conversations follow a logical path and I prefer to speak in detail about facts rather than how you "feel" about things. That may sound rude but the truth is that I don't care about feelings, my only concern is that my clan can participate in the best possible competitive event around.

xLASTx ]

The one thing i don't like about your list is the 5 cap limit on capture the flag i mean one team could win before the half time switch an i like wars to last thats all. Another thing is the game is pretty fair how its set up in each an every lobby so maybe UF should keep the game modes for there matches just how IW has them now that way clans don't have to make special rooms to practice for there upcoming matches, your clan can just go into a normal lobby an play the match an know that in the war that night it will be the same just don't allow 203's an thats it no big changes or anything.

I actually thought about that cap issue and jumped on the game just to test it. My thought was that if you let someone get 5 flags on you then you deserve to lose(LOL). But seriously, ultimately I thought having a cap would just make it so that everyone knows if you allow those 5 you're going to lose. I just don't see the switch sides as that big of a deal on that mode. From what I've seen so far the maps are all laid out evenly almost like big squares but I can see where you're coming from. The cap on the flags isn't something that I think is a huge deal, if it was just left unlimited and just time based I think you achieve the same goal.

As for the setups, there is going to be no way to just leave it as IW has set for each of those modes. If they go with Hardcore settings you'll never be able to capture that aspect of the game while playing normally because HC is only available on two modes(on the game play list). So at some point you're going to run into a problem when it comes to the settings.

SnowBud ]

I could see maybe a Horseman style 4v4 with the new TPS for COD but I am going to have to agree with CDB on this one. For tac map and black style I think it needs to be what the overwhelming majority of COD players play and its not the TPS mode. Especially if you truly want to see this place grow with COD players, people who aren't socom transplants don't play that mode period.

I'm not saying that you're wrong(yet) but I just don't understand how you can state something like this. Do you know for a FACT that "the overwhelming majority" of MW2 players are NOT playing 3rd person? If so could you please include the statistics and cite them?

If not then I don't see how you can even make a claim like that with any confidence.

Crusty_Demons ]

I think one of the things that 3rd person mode is missing is precision aiming cross hairs. I like 3rd person and play it pretty often mostly because I'm brain washed by Zipper. lol

 

3rd person is a little awkward and clunky but it is an alternative for people who really can't or don't want to play 1st person. I personally love being able to see my characters feet while playing. I go back and forth between 1st and 3rd.

I've found that enjoy both very much, I do very well in both setups(statistically speaking). In my clan there are some people that HATE 3rd person and then I have others that just LOVE IT. IMO IW made a smart decision by including it in the game, they've broadened their audience and if nothing else I'm happy to see that they called something "tactical" about their game. Which is something that they were very adamant before the release of COD4 that the game would not be.

As I stated previously in this thread I think it would be a great idea to incorporate this in some way. Right now from the research I've done there is no competitive arena that is offering anything in 3rd person. Which could mean that UF would have that "genre"(for lack of a better term) cornered.

CDBS14 ]

no one plays third person mode' date=' it sucks. it is just like a small add on, like a mini game.

[/quote']

 

"no one" seems like a very absolute term to use. I have an entire segment of my clan that is mainly interested in playing competitively in the 3rd person perspective. So there are people that enjoy playing it and are interested in it on a competitive level.

WaR-Do6 ]

Like Fluid said if you have more then 8 players on you can continue to invite them to your party and when the game starts it will split you up into 2 squads. The bad thing is you can't see if the person is in the party until the game starts so you have to take roll call.

Correct because it's a bug in the system, I've had this discussion on the beta forums and as of right now it's something that Zipper is considering expanding. However, it will not be available at launch and it is only something that MAY come a few months after the fact. Which for me means this game is dead even before it arrives.

xRuthlessRebelx ]

I agree that getting kills is fine in standard mode as I stated in my original post. I would only want it on hardcore so there is no radar unless someone calls in a UAV. You can play hardcore and raise the health from minuscule to normal.

This is a good point, I think it makes sense.

I say mix it up, do full respawn radar and perks some nights, and one or two of the nights do "DIE HARD NIGHT" or something.

Just for clarity could you explain what you mean by "respawn radar"? Are you saying you'd like to have radar switched to "always on"? If so I'd have to say that IMO it's probably the idea I like least for any competitive match next to a sanctioned team kill theme night!

 

the good thing is, that in regular mode in MW2, it is still pretty good. In COD4 it took alot of kill someone, so Hardcore was the way to go...However, I disagree with having radar always on...Radar should never be alwasy on in a UF war, thats my opinion:)

This is a very good point, which is why I changed my stance on the settings when I made my initial "recommendations" within this thread. Which is saying a lot because in the poll about two months ago I voted for Hardcore and made some pretty strong statements for Hardcore Only.

Maybe the UF admins would consider putting up a new vote for Hardcore or Normal settings? I have a sense that the results would be dramatically different now that we've all played MW2.

mikejaxon ]

Covert-OPs_ ]

mikejaxon ]

Covert-OPs_ ]

This might not be a popular idea but it's something I just thought of. What if the attacking clan gets pick on whether or not the match is played in First Person or Third Person?

 

This would be a total disadvantage to the defending clan, if anything the defending clan should have the choice as it's their territory. Besides that, COD is a FPS if we wanted to play a third person shooter we would stick with Socom.

 

 

 

If it was ONLY a FPS then they would not have included the Third Person option. Now the roots of the game may be FPS but for you to say it's an FPS is not a factual statement. As for how attacks work, some would say playing at night is a disadvantage to the defending clan. Some clans play better at night then during the day(as an option) which would be a parallel to my suggestion. Some clans may perform better FPS than TPS, this isn't anything new to how attacks/defenses work in the UF community. I knew it wasn't likely to be a popular idea which I made sure to state initially. But the direction you've take your argument in doesn't make much sense.

 

I never said it was "ONLY" a first person shooter, I was referring to its roots like you mentioned. Which in my opinion is what makes a game. For example if they added a FPS view on socom to CERTAIN game modes, the game would still be considered a TPS. Its what the game was built on, its the way the game should be played. As far as the attack/defense option, look at it like this, your defending a specific area you are allready fortified in that position. You have the advantage of the area it should be your choice if its being considered as an option. It is drastically different then night or day, its two different styles of game play. It's not something I personally would ever like to see in a tac map, but possibly a Black theme night. It wasnt an argument it was just my opinion which I'm entitled to, to whom it makes sense to is their own opinion.

 

 

Understood and like I said in my initial post about it and in my response to you, I expected people to not agree. My response to you was just a FACTUAL one, it's not a FPS only anymore. And as for your Socom comparison, there was a time when Socom supported both FP and TP. But I do understand what you're saying as far as it's roots. My opinion however is that it would be a waste to not take advantage of the diversity that IW has now given competitive communities.

The night/day stuff I think is as close as to a parallel as you can get. But again I expect people would disagree with me.

mikejaxon ]

Covert-OPs_ ]

This might not be a popular idea but it's something I just thought of. What if the attacking clan gets pick on whether or not the match is played in First Person or Third Person?

 

This would be a total disadvantage to the defending clan, if anything the defending clan should have the choice as it's their territory. Besides that, COD is a FPS if we wanted to play a third person shooter we would stick with Socom.

 

 

If it was ONLY a FPS then they would not have included the Third Person option. Now the roots of the game may be FPS but for you to say it's an FPS is not a factual statement. As for how attacks work, some would say playing at night is a disadvantage to the defending clan. Some clans play better at night then during the day(as an option) which would be a parallel to my suggestion. Some clans may perform better FPS than TPS, this isn't anything new to how attacks/defenses work in the UF community. I knew it wasn't likely to be a popular idea which I made sure to state initially. But the direction you've take your argument in doesn't make much sense.

IRISH BULL ]

OK, thanks. I guess I can delete that massive beta off of my PS3 now. Actually, probably should have Nov.9th.

Makes two of us...a game that holds 256 players but only supports 8 player parties is a no go in my book.

I just hope we're not going to have a "sanctioned team killing night".

This might not be a popular idea but it's something I just thought of. What if the attacking clan gets pick on whether or not the match is played in First Person or Third Person?

WiZ ]

Covert-OPs_ ]

 

_________________________________________________

Team Death Match Settings:

Time: 10 Minutes

Score Limit: 10000 Points

Number of Lives: Unlimited

Respawn Delay: 5 Seconds

Max Health: Normal

Health Regeneration: Slow

Kill Cam: Disabled

Spectating: Team Only

Wave Spawn Delay: None

Force Respawn: Enabled

Radar Always On: No

Friendly Fire: On

Headshot Only: Disabled

Perks: Enabled

KillStreak Rewards: Enabled

Hardcore Mode: Disabled

3rd Person: Disabled

 

Search & Destroy:

Round Length: 3 Min

Bomb Timer: 1 Min

Plant Timer: 5 Sec

Defuse Timer: 7.5 Sec

Multi Bomb: Disabled

Score Limit: 4 Points (Could be more to setup something like Socom)

Round Switch: Every Round

Number of Lives: 1 Life

Respawn Delay: None

Max Health: Normal

Health Regen: None

Kill Cam: Enabled

 

Team Deathmatch - Don't care much for the unlimited lives if your going to disable the "Kill Cam". The UF used a set number of lives for Team Deathmatch and that worked out pretty good. I would like it to stay that way. And and don't remember the set up but it was longer than just 10 minutes.

I like that idea, as long as Kill Cam is DISABLED.

WiZ ]Search & Destroy - Its Call of Duty and the game should remain Call of Duty. It's always used 2 planting points in Search & Destroy and in my opinion should stay that way. Been awhile, but I think thats how we did it here in previous seasons. Not sure though....

I don't follow what you're saying, multi-bomb means everyone has a bomb. And I definitely think that should remain disabled.

WiZ ]Everything else I agree with.... I don't feel "Hardcore Mode" is even needed. They have done a good job with the amount of bullets it requires to down somebody.

Agreed.

I have always been for hardcore because I felt that it was where competitive matches needed to be played. However with the new kill system I think regular is just as good. I'm very pleased with the way the game plays and haven't found many issues. I'm going to sit down and put together exactly the setup I'd use for wars while I'm looking at them individually.

What I will say is that death streaks should ONLY BE ALLOWED as CopyCat. I would say to disable them but you can't. To have anything that rewards a LOSER in a competitive match is ridiculous! It goes against my principles and something that upsets me just knowing it's in the game!

_________________________________________________

Team Death Match Setings:

Time: 10 Minutes

Score Limit: 10000 Points

Number of Lives: Unlimited

Respawn Delay: 5 Seconds

Max Health: Normal

Health Regeneration: Slow

Kill Cam: Disabled

Spectating: Team Only

Wave Spawn Delay: None

Force Respawn: Enabled

Radar Always On: No

Friendly Fire: On

Headshot Only: Disabled

Perks: Enabled

KillStreak Rewards: Enabled

Hardcore Mode: Disabled

3rd Person: Disabled

Perks, Killstreaks, Hardcore & 3rd Person settings could be used for "theme nights". So whether they're disabled or enabled could be part of what normally is laser tag night or what I've called "It's ok to team kill night"(I won't get started on that). Below I've done the other modes but just their specific settings that are not part of the basic ones above.

Search & Destroy:

Round Length: 3 Min

Bomb Timer: 1 Min

Plant Timer: 5 Sec

Defuse Timer: 7.5 Sec

Multi Bomb: Disabled

Score Limit: 4 Points (Could be more to setup something like Socom)

Round Switch: Every Round

Number of Lives: 1 Life

Respawn Delay: None

Max Health: Normal

Health Regen: None

Kill Cam: Enabled

Sabotage:

Time Limit: 20 min

Bomb Timer: 45 Sec

Plant Time: 2.5 Sec

Defuse Time 5 Sec

Shared Bomb Timer: No

Number of Lives: Unlimited

Respawn Delay: 7.5 Sec

Max Health: Normal

Health Regen: Slow

Kill Cam: Disabled

Domination:

Time Limit: Unlimited

Score Limit: 200 Pts

Number of Lives: Unlimited

Respawn Delay: 5 Sec

Max Health: Normal

Health Regen: Slow

Kill Cam: Disabled

Capture the Flag:

Time Limit: 10 Minutes

Score Limit: 5 Points

Number of Lives: Unlimited

Respawn Delay: 5 Seconds

Max Health: Normal

Health Regen: Slow

Kill Cam: Disabled

Demolition:

Time Limit: 3 Min

Round Switch: Every Round

Bomb Timer: 45 Sec

Plant Timer: 5 Sec

Defuse Timer: 5 Sec

Extra Time: 2.5 Min

Number of Lives: Unlimited

Respawn Delay: 5 Sec

Max Health: Normal

Health Regen: Slow

Kill Cam: Disabled

Headquarters:

I have not played so I don't want to give any settings for it.

Co-Op is 2 player LAN, Split Screen or Online.

Tool_Minion ]

who cares about stats?!

 

I am just juiced I will be getting it this evening.

Oh it has nothing to do with stats, it has to do with the unlocks. Remember this isn't like Socom you only start out with 4 guns available to you. And while the first few ranks are quick there are things like the radar jamming perk and claymores that take at least a day to get to. Not to mention I have my M4 all tricked out because I've completed all the weapons attachments for it. So it will definitely give those who have been playing all weekend a clear advantage for a few days.

Deathnote ]

Got mine as well, but Infinity Ward is now saying they will not be doing a stat reset cause there not going to punish people that bought the game legit.

Are you sure?

Nice I'll send you a game invite next time I'm online with my guys.

Xx-CHURCHY-xX ]

 

And also, the way this game was made, they were trying to stop campers. That's why you seem to get UAV's all the time. With this "constant" flow of UAV's in the air, campers have to keep moving around instead of sitting in a corner with claymores. That's also why claymores now take up your grenade spot and you only get ONE claymore if you decide to switch.

I don't think I could speak to their motives as to why they have "super UAV" in this game. But I do know for a fact from two conversations that I had directly with 420 after the release of COD4 that they're not interested in clans & the "hardcore". He made that pretty much clear in that conversation and then during an interview later on with 1UP on their Up Yours podcast from 2008. Where he called clans "stupid" and that "clans play the game to much so they figure out how to break it", I can look for the interview if you'd like.

Combine that with "death streaks" where you're given a perk or a reward for getting your ass kicked. Those two things give me the impression that the state of the UAV is to help the noobs. Since unlocking the ColdBlooded perk which blocks UAV I have been tearing through people. I think it makes a big difference but again this is just one man's opinion based on three days worth of play...a lot can change after playing a game for a month.

IRISH BULL ]

 

Are these all the perks available? Because I don't see deep impact, which I always had.

Those look correct to me.

I did all the pics for the UF admins, CLICK HERE.